[wp_ad_camp_2]This is the final part of the Totally Gundogs Clicker Retrieve.
This part is all about delivery.
Before you begin this section you need to have worked your way through the previous ones, beginning with Part One: Touching the Dummy.
At the end of this section we will also look a how you can take this trained retrieve out into the field and start using it for real retrieves.
From spitting out to delivering to hand
You are going to teach the dog that instead of spitting out the dummy to get his treat, he needs to place it into your hand.
There are a number of different ways to get this delivery to hand.
Some clicker retrieves teach the delivery first, before teaching the dog to pick up off the floor.
I used to do this. Some teach it at the end as we are doing here, but also teach the dog to touch the handler’s hand with his nose, and then put the pick up and hand touch together.
I don’t do that.
The way I do it is to shape the approach, add a sit, and then teach the dog to hold on to the dummy in front of me, and finally to place it deliberately into my outstretched hand.
None of these ways is right or wrong, they are just different ways of doing things.
Remember that the click marks the end of the retrieve, and the dog must let go of the dummy when he hears it. Later we can replace the click with a ‘release the dummy’ command.
What if he doesn’t let go?
It is really important that you do not attempt to take the dummy from the dog. If you have had problems with your dog wanting to ‘possess’ or ‘run away with’ the dummy then he is more likely to want to hang on to it. The clicker retrieve helps to resolve this by teaching the dog that it is rewarding to release the dummy. He must learn to ‘spit out’ before he learns to ‘deliver’
If the dog does not spit out the dummy when he hears the click, you need to encourage him to do so. Show him the treat, put it near to his nose and wait for him to drop the dummy. If he still hangs on to it, your treats need to be revised. Try moist juicy meat, (roast chicken, beef or ham is ideal). And train when he is hungry.
Before we move on to delivery, let’s get the dog to bring the dummy right in close.
Approaching you with the dummy
Getting the dog to approach you with the dummy is usually very simple. You have the treat which he wants, and he has learned to hold the dummy in his mouth. Stepping back, patting your leg, or gently saying his name is usually enough to get the dog moving towards you.
Remember that each session starts with you placing the dummy on the floor. As soon as the dog picks up and raises his head, take a couple of steps back and encourage him towards you. Move back a bit further if necessary to get him moving too.
You will C&T any movement towards you at all whilst holding the dummy. Do not wait for the dog to reach you. C&T the first two steps in your direction. If you struggle with this, you can first C&T him for turning his head in your direction.
Do not put your hand out or try to take the dummy yet.
Once you have the dog moving at least two steps towards you with the dummy in his mouth, five times in a row, you can raise your standards a bit. Now you will only C&T when the dog reaches you.
So as soon as he picks up, take a couple of steps back as before then stand still as he moves towards you. C&T when he is right in front of you, don’t C&T if he spits out before he reaches you.
Practice moving in different directions and over slightly longer distances.
Do not put your hand out or try to take the dummy yet!
Once the dog will approach you with the dummy in his mouth, consistently, five times in a row, you can start to add the sit.
Adding a sit
Many gundog trainers do not worry about a sitting delivery, however, I have found that with the clicker retrieve adding a sit is helpful because it encourages the dog to lift up his head and makes him less likely to shuffle about. It seems to make the process ‘smoother’.
To add the sit, you will simply ask the dog to sit when he reaches you. If he spits out the dummy before his bottom hits the ground, no C&T. Provided that the dummy is still in his mouth you need to C&T as soon as he completes the sit.
Then you will need to add a few seconds to the ‘holding sit’. So that you reach a point where the dog brings you the dummy, and sits in front of you holding it for several seconds
Build up the number of seconds slowly, two seconds, then three and so on, and keep your hands away from the dummy! See the picture at the top of the page.
When you have a nice sit and hold of around five seconds at the end of each pick up, you are ready for the delivery.
Delivering to hand
Because the dog is used to seeing your hand produce a treat, it is a very natural reaction for the dog to spit out the dummy as soon as you move your hands towards him. This is why traditional trainers do not like to use treats for retrieving.
However, it is a straightforward matter to teach the dog to carry on holding the dummy until you are ready for him to release the dummy into your hand. It just needs to be carried out in little steps.
Have your dog sit in front of you holding the dummy, have your hands well up and away from the dogs mouth.
Now decide which hand you are going to use to receive the dummy and move ONE finger of that hand. Just wiggle it a bit.
Is the dog still holding the dummy? Good, then C&T
Did he spit out the dummy when he saw your finger move? This is very common. Do not C&T. Take a couple of steps away from the dummy and wait for him to pick it up again. Wait for him to approach you and sit holding the dummy. Now repeat as above only with a much smaller movement of your finger.
Repeat until you find a movement of your finger that does not cause the dog to spit out the dummy. Get five successful C&Ts in a row before returning to a bigger and more obvious movement of your finger.
Build up slowly adding more movement of the hand until you can move any of your fingers around without the dog letting go of the dummy.
The next step is to teach the dog to hold the dummy whilst you move your hand towards him. Only a small movement to start with. Just move your delivery hand half an inch or so towards the dog and away again.
Do not try and grab the dummy yet. Just move your hand towards the dog a little bit and then away again. C&T if he holds the dummy until you have completed this movement, make the exercise easier if he doesn’t.
Repeat until you have your five in a row then gradually increase the movement of your hand until you can put out your hand and hold it underneath the dog’s mouth without him letting go.
Still do not take the dummy. Bring your hand away and C&T.
The dummy is still dropping onto the floor. Take some time over this step. Make sure that the dog is completely comfortable with your hand coming to towards him, being placed under his mouth, and taken away again.
Into your hand
From there progress to putting your hand below the dog’s mouth and then raising it to touch the dummy. Still the dog must not let go until you C&T. Once he is comfortable with this you are ready to leave your delivery hand in place as you C&T so that the dummy drops into your hand when the dog lets go.
At last the dummy is being released into your hand and not falling on the floor. Whilst the dog is collecting his well earned treat you can put the dummy back on the floor and move away from it for the next repetition.
Practice until you have five perfect deliveries in a row. Now it is time for the finishing touches.
The dog becomes responsible
This important stage makes the dog responsible for ensuring that the dummy is delivered safely into your hand. The way you do this is to begin to make it a little more difficult for the dummy to land there. Put out your hand but instead of placing it directly under the dog’s mouth have it slightly to one side.
The first time you do this the dummy will drop to the floor. Say nothing. Do not C&T. Just wait for the dog to pick it up again. For the next couple of deliveries make sure that the dummy lands in your hand. Now try moving your hand to one side again, letting the dummy fall to the floor.
As you repeat this process, sometimes letting the dummy fall, and sometimes making sure it drops into your hand, the dog will work out that if the dummy falls into your hand he will get his reward, but if it falls to the floor, he will not. When this realisation dawns on him, he will begin to deliberately ensure that the dummy lands in your hand by moving his mouth over your hand in a purposeful way.
This is a bit of a Eureka moment.
Some dogs grasp this more quickly than others, but they all get there in the end. Don’t rush it, or allow the dog to experience too many failures along the way, make sure that the dummy sometimes lands in your hand so that he can be rewarded some of the time.
Maintaining standards
Once the dog is deliberately moving the dummy into your hands, you can develop the final delivery position that you want. I recommend that you keep your hand close to your body and ensure that the dog has to lift his head up high to deliver. Obviously the height of your hands at this point will depend on the height of your dog.
Now you have raised your standards, be sure to keep them high. Don’t accept anything less than a purposeful and tidy delivery right into your hand.
Never reward for a dummy that falls on the floor and never reach your hand out to a dog that is moving his head away from you or ducking it down.
The release command
Now you have your nice delivery you can begin to add the release command. I use ‘dead’. You can use ‘give’ if you prefer. It does not matter. Just say your release command immediately before you click. After a few sessions, the word ‘give’ predicts the click, and you can start to omit the click.
It goes from this:
The dog approaches you with the dummy in his mouth and sits in front of you. You place your hand under his mouth and say ‘dead’ followed immediately by C&T. The dog releases the dummy into your hand.
To this:
The dog approaches you with the dummy in his mouth and sits in front of you. You place your hand under his mouth and say ‘dead’. The dog releases the dummy into your hand and you give him a treat.
What if the dog won’t release when you say ‘dead’? Just wait patiently show him the treat, click if he doesn’t let go within five seconds. Within a few repetitions he will be releasing the dummy on your cue.
Proper retrieves
You can now begin turning your new trained retrieve into the ‘real thing’ outdoors. Start with very short and very obvious retrieves. Literally a couple of yards away. Get the dog picking these up outdoors and in different locations, then start to increase distances gradually.
Once you have successfully tacked your trained retrieve and delivery on to the end of some ‘real’ retrieves, you can begin to make your rewards more intermittent and unpredictable. For many gundogs, retrieving is in itself highly rewarding and motivating. But the delivery still needs to be recognised as a ‘sacrifice’ for many dogs, and one that needs the motivation of a reward. Especially early on in the dog’s career.
Once a dog is involved in fieldwork, and retrieving real game, he is likely to be only to happy to hand you a bird so that he can have the fun of finding another one. But for the time being, remember to reward your dog with a nice treat every now and then, for handing over his precious retrieve.
Problems?
If you find yourself struggling at any point always go back a step to a stage where you were succeeding. Clicker training should be an upbeat and fairly fast process: action-click-treat, action-click-treat, over and over. Check out Youtube for clicker training videos
The pace of clicker training is sometimes a surprise to traditional trainers but the constant action helps to hold the dog’s interest. Never persist if the dog is not winning treats, always go back to a point where he can earn rapid and successive rewards. Then move forwards again gradually. Everybody has to do this at some point in the process.
Let’s sum up
In this section you will need to work through the steps as described above. Take it one step at a time. You will get there.
- The dog walks towards you holding the dummy
- The dog sits in front of you holding the dummy
- The dog holds the dummy whilst you move your hand a little bit
- The dog holds the dummy whilst you put your hand beneath his mouth and then withdraw it
- The dog releases the dummy into your hand
- The dog deliberately places the dummy into your hand
You started this section with a dog that would pick up the dummy and hold it for several seconds. You made sure that the dog would spit out the dummy when he hears the click.
Once you have worked through the steps above you will have a dog that will pick up the dummy from the ground and deliver it into your hand. If he drops a dummy, he will pick it up again.
He will ensure that the dummy is delivered safely into your care at all times.
Keep your standards high, and he won’t let you down.
Really valuable information. I read your Happy Puppy Handbook when we got our working cocker spaniel bitch and it was all fantastic. She is nearly 6 months old now, has a high chase drive and an average retrieve! I am hoping to get her retrieving really well so that it minimises her desire to chase cats/rabbits/ chickens!
There is just one question – we bought her as a pet rather than a gundog, so can I use a tennis ball or other high value toy instead of a dummy? Equally, have you any other suggestions for reducing chasing behaviour?
Many Thanks
Naomi
I have a couple of issues with my enthusiastic 2 year old Labrador dog. THe main on us that he returns so fast from a retrieve that he consistently fails to put the brakes on in time to stop nicely in front if me.
The second is that he has started always trying to pick up the dummy by the end and not the middle , which makes it more difficult to carry…..
Hi Pippa
Our six month old retriever pup picks up the dummy and brings it to me very consistently, but drops the dummy every time I ask him to sit. He’s not got a very strong retrieval drive, and I’m worried that if I don’t reward him for bringing me the dummy the retrieval behaviour will extinguish before it ever occurs to him to sit with the dummy in his mouth. What should I do? Is there a way I can get him to deliver to hand first then add the sit?
Best wishes
James
wwwhappyandrelaxeddogs.com
Good morning Pippa.
One of my older PU dogs has started to refuse to hand over game (or dummies) when he has had to work “hard” for it. And I think what you have described here will work for us , I am however really lousy with a clicker may I use a marker word ?
Thanks
You can certainly substitute a verbal event marker for the clicker Marina 🙂
thanks Pippa 🙂
Hi Pippa,
Thank you for the excellent, clear, concise writing on your posts and Total Recall.
I have a 18 month welsh springer that has a perfect recall – thanks to you, but has been delicate to train to retrieve. I am working through clicker training per your posts.
Is it better to:
A. take a small step back when starting each session, and then quickly advance to where the dog left off, or
B. Start at the point the dog has last had some intermittent success?
I am building hold times of 1-3 seconds, but wondering if I should click a “toss” on the first touch of the session?
I am getting the dummy tossed and flpped quite regularly, but also getting some great holds.
My treats are very high quality moist, warm, flavourful meats from our dinners.
Thank you!
Russ
Alberta, Canada
Hi Russ, it does no harm to take a step back, but if the session is the same day or next day, then you may be able to push straight on. With clicker training, there is no harm done, just step back a little if the dog starts to make mistakes. And good luck with your training 🙂
YES!!!! This is wonderful! Thank you Pippa!
I shall let you know how it goes!
Hi Pippa
I am reading through your Total recall book but at the same time looking into how I get my dog to retrieve a ball and deliver (without barking) and then when the game is over he comes back. (Working on the recall now without ball). On trained retrieve you mention using the clicker but for recall the whistle. Can you use the whistle in the same way for a trained retrieve? Or do I need a clicker as well as the whistle
Thanks
Brian
Hi Brian, whistles and clickers have entirely different functions. The whistle is a cue to tell your dog you expect a response. The clicker is an event marker to tell your dog he just did something great. We wouldn’t normally use a whistle as an event marker (at least not in dog training) because we use whistles as cues and don’t want to muddle the dog.
You don’t need a clicker for recall as it is usually pretty clear to the dog what he did right – and as the recall ends next to you, it is easy to reward him immediately he completes the recall.
We don’t normally use a whistle cue to initiate the retrieve (though later you can add a ‘hunt’ whistle) but you do need an event marker because the stages in teaching the pick up and hold are hard for the dog to identify without one.
If by your question you are asking if you can use your whistle as an event marker to train the clicker retrieve the answer is no, it is not a good idea. So you will need to get yourself a clicker.
You might find these two articles helpful
What are clickers for
What are whistles for
Thanks I appreciate the quick response. Will give it a go. Cheers Brian
Any suggestions for 4 year old lab who is good with his training on our own, delivering immediately nicely to hand. But when in a group he is possessive with the dummy and won’t come back immediately, can come near and plays with the dummy in his mouth.
Walks nicely to heel, does food recall whistle. It’s just when others around that he messes about, as if showing off.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Sue
Hi Sue, you may need to practice some controlled deliveries on a long lead, in the vicinity of the group, but not so close that he feels the need to be silly. And gradually move the exercise closer to the other dogs. Lots of dogs new to group work, worry that other members in the group are going to take the retrieve. This usually resolves with practice, provided you make sure none of the other dogs mug him. 🙂
Thank you for suggestion. I can take him slightly away from the group and he delivers to hand nicely off lead. Its only when back in group he is silly, picks up dummy at end and shakes it like a toy. I am not sure whether he is being plain naughty or a little anxious. As you know, can get conflicting opinions. Am just embarking on the clicker training. I just need to know whether to go right back to the beginning with look, then C&T, slightly up to the last stage of delivering to hand. Problem is that he picks it up perfectly and delivers to hand without any trouble. I then click and treat and he releases it into my hand. At a lesson after being silly I took him to one side and did some clicker training. It is just getting the training to work in the group situation. I rather fear that this habit is ingrained now and he will also behave this way.
Would really welcome your advice about the clicker training. I know it won’t work in just 5 days!
Thanks. Sue
Hi Sue,
It may take several sessions to get him retrieving closer and closer to the group. I’d start with a controlled delivery on the lead to begin with and stop giving him any more opportunities to rehearse the shaking behaviour. (i.e. no more retrieves in front of the group where you have no control over what he does with the dummy) If you are not sure what I mean by controlled delivery on lead, I’ll give you a link to a video.
Be good to see the video please. Thanks for quick reply. Shall I go through 4 stages of clicker training too, bearing in mind that he picks it up and brings it back to me nicely on my own. Will clicker training help?
Thanks again.
Hi pippa
I have aready bought your book and it has been a great help. Now I’m at the point that my dog Brúnó is healing by my side, retreiving (inside) returning with the dummy from 4-5 meters away and delivering to my hand. But when I ask him to sit before delivery he spits out the dummy and doesn’t really know what to doo, looses his confidence and just lokks at me. Doo you have any smaller steps for me to doo in order for him to sit before delivery ???
Thans again for a great book and website 🙂
Hi Moses,
Glad you are enjoying the book.
Nowadays I normally use the method on the website and I add the sit before I teach the delivery part four See the paragraph entitled ‘approaching you with the dummy’. If you have missed this out, then at this point you have a couple of options.
And one is to accept a standing delivery. There is no requirement for a gundog to sit to deliver (at least not in the UK) and if your dog is delivering nicely whilst standing I might be tempted to leave well alone.
You could go back and work through part four putting the sit in before the delivery. Or you could attempt to press on by asking the dog to pick up again as soon as he has spat out. After a few repetitions with ‘no reward’ for spitting, he will figure out that he must hold on to the dummy even whilst he sits. Make sure you do plenty of standing deliveries if this is dragging out for a while, so that he gets plenty of rewards.
One of the nice things about the clicker delivery is that is the dog drops what he is carrying (accidentally or otherwise) he will quickly pick it up again when asked. Just make sure you reward what you want and ignore what you don’t want
To help him associate the sit and the hold together, you can practice a sitting hold separately from your retrieving sessions. You can ask the dog to sit, then give him the dummy from your hand. And let him hold it for a while before taking it from him.
Some people teach a hold like this before teaching the dog to pick up from the floor. That’s the method in the book. It doesn’t matter which you do. It’s all about finding what works best for you and your dog.
Pippa
Hi Pippa,
I too have your book and it’s great. I have a 6 month old pup who’s awesome in almost all situations but likes playing with other dogs too much! Back to basics on his recall….
Anyhow, I started training your clicker retrieve yesterday and after 3 x 10 min sessions we’re ready to start stage 3. This feels very quick having read your article, but I think it’s just that he’s a quick learner. (He’s my first dog so I’m on a steep learning curve!) Now that he’s reliably picking up before c&t is it okay to move on so quickly?
My second and most important question is in relation to what happens after stage 4. There are 2 elements:
1. How should I send the dog off to get the dummy (do I just chuck it and hope he goes after it!? Should I make him wait and then create a a command to send him off?)
2. How do I replace the dummy with something else such as a bird or a ball without retraining for each new object?
Any advice you can offer will be much appreciated and thanks for such clear training advice both here and in your book.
Kind Regards,
John
Hi John, glad you like the book 🙂
Once you have completed the clicker retrieve, you can just progress to retrieving where you left off before you began the clicker retrieve training, but make the retrieves short and simple to begin with. If you had not steadied him before then you can do so at this point, provided he has plenty of drive. Don’t be in too much of a hurry, make sure he is reliable at each stage on a number of occasions before moving on.
I do not use the clicker to transition to game, unless the dog is reluctant to let go. Once you have got your delivery right, just proceed as normal. If you are not sure what is normal, have a look at the articles in the retrieving section, starting with the retrieving process explained
Pippa